Placebo Power: Belief, Brain, Health & Healing
This podcast describes the placebo effect, a fascinating phenomenon illustrating the mind’s capacity to influence physical health and healing. It reveals how belief and expectation can lead to genuine changes in the brain and body, triggering the release of neurotransmitters like endorphins and dopamine to alleviate pain and improve mood.
Key elements discussed include:
- The science behind the placebo effect, showing how it can activate specific brain areas involved in pain perception and emotional responses.
- The significant role of patient-doctor interactions, trust, and the ritual of treatment in amplifying therapeutic outcomes.
- The concept of conditioning (like Pavlovian response) and its contribution to how placebos work.
- How placebos can influence various physiological changes beyond self-report, such as heart rate, blood pressure, and anxiety levels.
- The contrast with the nocebo effect, where negative beliefs can lead to adverse physical symptoms.
- The ethical considerations of using placebos in both clinical practice and research.
- The implications for treatment and comprehensive treatment approaches that address both physical and emotional aspects of well-being.
Ultimately, the overview emphasizes the power within individuals to shape their health outcomes through their mindset and expectations.
0.000000 1.800000 - Welcome to Everyday Explained.
1.800000 4.360000 You're daily 20-minute dive into the fascinating house
4.360000 6.360000 and wise of the world around you.
6.360000 8.240000 I'm your host Chris, and I'm excited
8.240000 9.920000 to help you discover something new.
9.920000 11.200000 Let's get started.
11.200000 12.320000 - Welcome to The Deep Dive,
12.320000 15.440000 the show where we really get into the fascinating stuff
15.440000 18.320000 and pull out all the key bits from our sources for you.
18.320000 19.600000 Today we're jumping into something,
19.600000 22.640000 well, pretty mind-bending, the placebo effect.
22.640000 25.120000 It's often brushed off as like your mind
25.120000 26.760000 just playing tricks on you, right?
26.760000 28.760000 Or maybe just a sugar pill doing something.
28.760000 31.340000 But what if those tricks are, I don't know,
31.340000 34.560000 actually real, like scientifically solid responses
34.560000 35.600000 happening in our bodies?
35.600000 36.600000 - That's exactly it.
36.600000 38.440000 That's what makes it so fascinating.
38.440000 41.480000 The whole trick idea, yeah, it catches the imagination,
41.480000 44.760000 but the science, it goes way deeper than just illusion.
44.760000 48.080000 We're actually talking about real measurable effects.
48.080000 52.040000 It's a pretty powerful sign of how deeply connected
52.040000 53.920000 our beliefs and our biology really are.
53.920000 56.320000 So it's not just all in your head, like dismissively.
56.320000 59.280000 It's literally in your brain influencing your body,
59.280000 60.120000 you can measure it.
60.120000 61.560000 - Right, that totally shifts how you think about it.
61.560000 64.120000 Okay, so for This Deep Dive, our mission is,
64.120000 66.200000 well, let's unpack the science, figure out
66.200000 68.720000 how our minds can actually affect our physical health.
68.720000 71.120000 And we'll look at some of the ethical stuff too,
71.120000 73.200000 and maybe even find ways you can sort of harness
73.200000 74.480000 this power day to day.
74.480000 75.920000 We've got some great sources lined up,
75.920000 78.520000 medical research, psychology insights, the works.
78.520000 81.280000 We're trying to get you clued in and hopefully,
81.280000 82.120000 pretty amazed.
82.120000 83.720000 So, shall we start?
83.720000 86.840000 - Okay, so where do we even begin defining
86.840000 89.160000 what this placebo effect actually is?
89.160000 91.480000 Beyond just mind tricks.
91.480000 92.800000 - Well, basically the placebo effect
92.800000 96.600000 is when you see real tangible changes in symptoms
96.600000 98.640000 after someone gets a treatment that,
98.640000 101.800000 well, it has no actual therapeutic value for what they have.
101.800000 103.640000 Think about that sugar pill you mentioned.
103.640000 107.120000 But the key thing is, it's not just about thinking positively,
107.120000 108.440000 like willing yourself better.
108.440000 110.880000 It's a genuine physical thing happening
110.880000 112.680000 because of your brain's influence.
112.680000 114.880000 And how did science actually start taking this seriously?
114.880000 116.080000 Does it have a history?
116.080000 118.160000 - Oh yeah, it goes back further than you might think,
118.160000 120.040000 like, to the 18th century.
120.040000 122.200000 But it really got cemented in modern science
122.200000 123.480000 thanks to Henry K. Beacher.
123.480000 125.560000 He wrote this really important article
125.560000 128.280000 back in 1955, the powerful placebo.
128.280000 131.160000 That paper, it really changed things,
131.160000 133.160000 put it right on the mat for medical research.
133.160000 134.000000 - Yeah.
134.000000 137.160000 - And now, it's standard and clinical trials.
137.160000 140.440000 They use a sham treatment, you know, like that sugar pill
140.440000 142.200000 to compare against the real drug.
142.200000 145.240000 It helps see how effective the drug actually is.
145.240000 147.040000 - Okay, so just to be super clear then,
147.040000 149.320000 it's not a trick, but what else isn't?
149.320000 151.040000 It's not like a miracle cure, is it?
151.040000 151.960000 - No, definitely not.
151.960000 154.000000 It's not self-deception and it's certainly not
154.000000 156.000000 some kind of magic wand for health.
156.000000 158.520000 And critically, it doesn't cure diseases.
158.520000 160.120000 Like, you can't just take a sugar pill
160.120000 161.080000 and make a tumor disappear.
161.080000 162.280000 That's not how it works.
162.280000 164.400000 Its real power is in easing symptoms,
164.400000 165.960000 reducing pain or discomfort,
165.960000 167.800000 and genuinely making you feel better.
167.800000 170.240000 Sometimes quite significantly better.
170.240000 172.160000 - Okay, this is where it gets really cool for me.
172.160000 174.000000 - We're talking about more than just feeling better.
174.000000 176.280000 How does the brain actually pull this off?
176.280000 178.240000 Is it, like you said, an inner pharmacy?
178.240000 179.840000 - Exactly like that.
179.840000 182.720000 Think of it as your brain having its own built-in pharmacy
182.720000 183.720000 ready to go.
183.720000 186.640000 Research, especially with things like FMRI scans,
186.640000 189.040000 shows that just the act of taking a treatment,
189.040000 193.000000 even if it's fake, can set off real neurobiological reactions.
193.000000 196.440000 We're talking, releasing chemicals, like endorphins,
196.440000 198.560000 you know, your body's natural pain killers.
198.560000 200.320000 - Oh, right, like runners high kind of thing.
200.320000 201.400000 - Sort of, yeah.
201.400000 203.880000 And dopamine, too, which affects mood and motivation,
203.880000 206.640000 so it literally changes your brain chemistry.
206.640000 210.440000 The scans show placebo's lighting up specific brain areas
210.440000 212.640000 involved in how we feel pain, our emotions,
212.640000 214.000000 even self-awareness.
214.000000 216.480000 It's actually tweaking how your brain interprets pain.
216.480000 218.520000 - It almost sounds like conditioning,
218.520000 219.480000 like Pavlov's dogs.
219.480000 222.320000 When you say the brain learns to release these chemicals,
222.320000 223.520000 is that a fair comparison?
223.520000 224.960000 - That's a great analogy actually.
224.960000 227.120000 Classical conditioning is a big part of it.
227.120000 229.240000 Think about taking a pill for a headache.
229.240000 231.400000 If you do it often and it works,
231.400000 234.160000 your brain starts to link the action,
234.160000 238.200000 taking that pill, it's look, it's feel with relief.
238.200000 240.600000 So later, if you get a placebo that looks the same,
240.600000 242.400000 your brain goes, ah, okay, relief time,
242.400000 244.080000 and starts those internal processes,
244.080000 245.560000 it's conditioned to expect it.
245.560000 248.000000 - So it's not just in your head, feeling wise,
248.000000 250.360000 there are actual physical changes happening.
250.360000 252.760000 - Absolutely, and this is the fascinating part.
252.760000 254.560000 It's not just subjective feelings.
254.560000 258.280000 Studies show real measurable physiological shifts,
258.280000 259.680000 not just feeling happier,
259.680000 262.480000 but actual changes in heart rate, blood pressure,
262.480000 265.760000 how anxious people feel, even physical fatigue.
265.760000 268.680000 There was this amazing study with asthma patients,
268.680000 269.800000 the ones who got a placebo,
269.800000 271.920000 they actually had less bronchial constriction.
271.920000 273.640000 Their error ways physically relax,
273.640000 275.560000 not just a feeling of breathing easier.
275.560000 278.000000 - Well, that's quite something.
278.000000 279.440000 When you talk about this inner pharmacy,
279.440000 281.280000 it makes me think of things like mind body medicine,
281.280000 284.480000 maybe psychoneuro immunology is at the bigger picture here.
284.480000 287.280000 - Yes, absolutely, it connects directly to those fields.
287.280000 290.600000 Mind body medicine and psychoneuro immunology,
290.600000 292.600000 which, I mean, that's basically the study of how
292.600000 295.160000 our thoughts and feelings, our nervous system,
295.160000 297.280000 and our immune system are all interconnected.
297.280000 298.720000 It's a two-way street.
298.720000 301.320000 It suggests the placebo effect isn't just random,
301.320000 305.160000 it's tapping into our own internal healing systems,
305.160000 309.000000 and crucially, it often involves reducing stress.
309.000000 311.520000 We all know stress is bad news for health, right?
311.520000 312.960000 It messes with our immune system.
312.960000 315.040000 You know that famous example of Tibetan monks,
315.040000 317.440000 meditating and generating enough body heat
317.440000 319.080000 to dry wet sheets in the cold.
319.080000 320.960000 That's an extreme example, maybe,
320.960000 324.240000 but it shows this incredible mind over body potential.
324.240000 325.840000 - So if we pull back a bit,
325.840000 328.800000 is it fair to say expectation is sort of the main ingredient
328.800000 330.000000 here, the driving force?
330.000000 331.640000 - Oh, without a doubt, expectation is huge.
331.640000 333.200000 Just believing an outcome will happen
333.200000 335.440000 can genuinely change how your brain and body function.
335.440000 336.720000 It really powers the whole thing.
336.720000 338.520000 - Yeah, and everyone knows that field, right?
338.520000 340.480000 You take that first sip of coffee in the morning
340.480000 343.240000 and boom, instantly more awake.
343.240000 345.200000 Even though caffeine hasn't even hit you yet,
345.200000 347.080000 it takes like 20 minutes, that's your brain,
347.080000 349.040000 just jumping the gun, saying, okay, caffeine's here,
349.040000 351.400000 let's go, pure expectation.
351.400000 353.640000 That's the coffee paradox for you.
353.640000 356.160000 A perfect everyday placebo.
356.160000 357.400000 - That's a brilliant example,
357.400000 359.520000 and it's not just personal expectation.
359.520000 362.080000 Other things really boost the effect too.
362.080000 365.560000 Take the whole interaction with a doctor or healthcare provider.
365.560000 369.480000 That relationship, the trust, feeling heard, that matters a lot,
369.480000 372.160000 and the whole ritual of treatment itself, you know?
372.160000 374.920000 The appointment, the exam, taking the pill,
374.920000 377.680000 it creates this powerful context of care.
377.680000 380.360000 It reinforces the expectation you'll get better.
380.360000 382.480000 Even subtle things like study showing
382.480000 384.400000 an expensive looking brand name pill
384.400000 387.000000 might feel more effective than a cheap generic one.
387.000000 388.800000 The context sends a message.
388.800000 390.840000 - And it works for quite a range of things, doesn't it?
390.840000 392.240000 Not just one or two conditions.
392.240000 393.720000 Where do we see it most often?
393.720000 396.680000 - Yeah, it's quite broad, especially for conditions
396.680000 399.840000 with subjective symptoms or a big stress component,
399.840000 402.400000 things like chronic pain, depression,
402.400000 406.120000 even symptoms of Parkinson's disease, IBS allergies,
406.120000 407.800000 and it's really important to remember,
407.800000 409.400000 for things like antidepressants,
409.400000 412.360000 a big chunk of why they work seems to be tied up
412.360000 413.800000 with this placebo effect.
413.800000 415.440000 Doesn't mean the drugs do nothing,
415.440000 417.520000 but the mind body part is significant.
417.520000 420.120000 - Okay, well wait, if positive belief helps,
420.120000 422.880000 does negative belief hurt?
422.880000 425.480000 Is there like an evil twin, the Nosebo effect?
425.480000 426.320000 Is that what it's called?
426.320000 427.560000 - Precisely, the Nosebo effect.
427.560000 428.720000 It's the flip side.
428.720000 431.000000 When negative beliefs are expectations about something,
431.000000 432.520000 a treatment, a situation actually lead
432.520000 434.000000 to negative outcomes or side effects,
434.000000 436.080000 even if the thing itself is totally harmless.
436.080000 437.560000 - Oh, I have a great example for this.
437.560000 439.760000 Okay, imagine you're a barista, right?
439.760000 444.360000 And you accidentally tell a lactose intolerant customer,
444.360000 446.600000 their coffee has regular milk,
446.600000 448.560000 but it was actually lactose-free.
448.560000 450.320000 If they suddenly get stomach cramps
450.320000 452.640000 because they believe they had regular milk, bam,
452.640000 454.760000 that's Nosebo.
454.760000 457.360000 Their belief caused a real physical reaction
457.360000 459.280000 even though the drink was fine.
459.280000 461.960000 Mind tricked them into feeling sick.
461.960000 464.160000 Hilarious, but also kind of scary.
464.160000 466.920000 - That's a perfect, very clear example
466.920000 469.600000 of how powerful negative expectation can be.
469.600000 472.880000 And obviously with effects this strong positive or negative,
472.880000 475.200000 it brings up tricky ethical questions,
475.200000 476.640000 especially in research.
476.640000 478.360000 How do you balance telling people exactly
478.360000 479.760000 what they're getting informed consent
479.760000 482.040000 with the fact that the placebo itself might help them?
482.040000 483.680000 It's why agencies like the FDA
483.680000 485.360000 demand that new drugs prove they work better
485.360000 487.360000 than a placebo just to get approved.
487.360000 489.400000 - Right, which actually makes it kind of a headache
489.400000 490.800000 for drug companies, doesn't it?
490.800000 492.680000 If the placebo works too well in a trial,
492.680000 495.160000 it can make their actual drug look less impressive.
495.160000 498.680000 So they almost have an incentive to try and minimize
498.680000 501.600000 the placebo response so their drug stands out more,
501.600000 502.800000 which feels a bit weird.
502.800000 506.320000 - It is a challenge in research, definitely a double edged sword,
506.320000 508.560000 but it's also pushed things forward ethically,
508.560000 513.040000 like this really interesting idea of open label placebos.
513.040000 514.760000 Patients know they're getting a placebo.
514.760000 515.720000 They're told it's inactive,
515.720000 518.200000 but also told about the placebo effect itself,
518.200000 520.960000 and guess what, they still often experience benefits.
520.960000 523.200000 It really shows the mind's power.
523.200000 525.000000 Even when you're fully aware,
525.000000 527.520000 it kind of bypasses the whole deception issue.
527.520000 529.200000 - And this isn't just happening in labs, right?
529.200000 531.360000 Doctors use this stuff in the real world.
531.360000 532.200000 - Oh, absolutely.
532.200000 533.440000 There was a UK study.
533.440000 537.480000 I think around 2013 found something like 97% of doctors
537.480000 539.840000 admitted using classebos in some form.
539.840000 542.160000 Now that doesn't usually mean handing out sugar pills
542.160000 544.240000 knowingly, it's often more subtle,
544.240000 547.120000 like expressing strong confidence in a treatment,
547.120000 549.640000 or just the reassurance that comes from the ritual
549.640000 550.640000 of care itself.
550.640000 552.280000 And the benefits are pretty clear, right?
552.280000 554.960000 Placebos are safe, they're cheap, non-addictive,
554.960000 557.600000 they offer hope, they kind of mobilize the body's own
557.600000 559.080000 healing resources.
559.080000 561.240000 The medical world is definitely becoming more accepting,
561.240000 562.880000 moving past the old stigma,
562.880000 564.520000 seeing it as something that can ethically
564.520000 568.000000 compliment standard treatments, empowering the patient, really.
568.000000 570.440000 - Okay, so, expert, this is the big takeaway
570.440000 571.520000 for everyone listening, right?
571.520000 574.200000 If your mind has this amazing built in power,
574.200000 576.160000 this inner pharmacy.
576.160000 579.400000 Can you actually use it yourself to feel better,
579.400000 580.520000 maybe perform better?
580.520000 584.360000 And it sounds like the answer is yes, not magic,
584.360000 585.800000 but definitely powerful.
585.800000 587.240000 - Absolutely, yes.
587.240000 589.080000 And there are practical ways to do it,
589.080000 590.120000 drawing on psychology.
590.120000 592.440000 One strategy is essentially pretending.
592.440000 595.200000 It's not just fake it till you make it exactly.
595.200000 598.200000 It's more about how your brain reads your actions,
598.200000 600.320000 your posture, even your facial expression.
600.320000 602.480000 If you act enthusiastic about a task,
602.480000 603.680000 even if you're dreading it,
603.680000 606.040000 your brain starts releasing chemicals associated
606.040000 607.280000 with that positive state.
607.280000 609.720000 It can genuinely change how you feel about the task.
609.720000 611.160000 It's like a feedback loop.
611.160000 613.280000 - That makes sense, your body signals your brain,
613.280000 615.400000 which changes your mind, which changes your experience.
615.400000 616.240000 Cool.
616.240000 617.080000 - Exactly.
617.080000 618.760000 Another one is focusing on what works.
618.760000 621.280000 We tend to notice the negatives, don't we?
621.280000 623.280000 So, deliberately shift your focus.
623.280000 625.480000 Look for the good parts of a situation,
625.480000 627.720000 or what is working in a habit you're building.
627.720000 629.360000 It's not about ignoring problems,
629.360000 631.920000 but about consciously directing your attention.
631.920000 634.720000 Then there's establishing a causal relationship,
634.720000 638.040000 really deep in your belief in why your actions matter.
638.040000 640.440000 Think about the purpose behind your habits.
640.440000 641.720000 Why are you exercising?
641.720000 643.680000 Why is that ritual important?
643.680000 647.720000 Understanding the why makes the action more potent.
647.720000 649.440000 - It's like building your own story around it,
649.440000 650.480000 making it meaningful.
650.480000 651.320000 - Precisely.
651.320000 653.800000 And lastly, creating detailed rituals.
653.800000 655.960000 This taps right into that classical conditioning
655.960000 658.080000 we talked about, say, for sleep.
658.080000 659.520000 Instead of just falling into bed,
659.520000 662.080000 create a specific routine, maybe a certain scent,
662.080000 664.440000 like lavender, some specific quiet music,
664.440000 667.280000 maybe even a special pair of socks you only wear for bed.
667.280000 668.840000 If you do it consistently,
668.840000 671.280000 eventually those things, the smell, the sound,
671.280000 673.520000 the feeling start signaling sleep time
673.520000 675.240000 to your brain automatically.
675.240000 676.720000 The more detailed and consistent,
676.720000 678.360000 the stronger the association.
678.360000 680.160000 - Oh, and what about that fun one?
680.160000 682.440000 Prescribing yourself magical medicine.
682.440000 684.560000 That sounds right up the placebo alley,
684.560000 686.520000 like you choose a specific food,
686.520000 688.960000 maybe a focus walnut before a meeting like you said,
688.960000 691.480000 or a special lucky shirt for presentations.
691.480000 692.320000 - Exactly.
692.320000 694.280000 Pick something harmless, obviously.
694.280000 695.960000 Certain tea, a smooth stone,
695.960000 697.120000 you keep in your pocket, whatever,
697.120000 699.120000 and you imbue it with meaning.
699.120000 702.560000 This tea helps me relax, this stone helps me concentrate.
702.560000 705.200000 If you consistently pair the item or action
705.200000 709.120000 with the intention, you can build a genuine placebo response.
709.120000 712.240000 It's playful, but it underlines how even small,
712.240000 715.080000 environmental cues, colors, smells, objects
715.080000 717.440000 can influence us if we expect them to.
717.440000 719.520000 It's all about building those positive links.
719.520000 722.160000 - So wrapping the saw up then, the placebo effect.
722.160000 723.360000 It's really not just a trick,
723.360000 726.800000 it's more like solid proof of that incredible link
726.800000 728.360000 between our minds and our bodies.
728.360000 731.120000 It really shows the amazing potential our minds have
731.120000 733.000000 to shape our physical reality.
733.000000 735.720000 - Exactly, and look, it's not gonna replace medicine
735.720000 738.320000 when you really need it, but understanding it.
738.320000 741.600000 It really highlights the power we all have inside us.
741.600000 743.520000 Our beliefs, our expectations,
743.520000 746.280000 even the rituals we create, they can boost our wellbeing,
746.280000 749.440000 and actually help traditional treatments work better too.
749.440000 752.920000 It's about being an active partner in your own health.
752.920000 755.600000 - So maybe something to think about this week.
755.600000 758.040000 What little belief, what small ritual could you bring
758.040000 759.640000 into your life, maybe something playful,
759.640000 762.240000 maybe something serious, just to see if you can unlock
762.240000 765.120000 a bit more focus or energy or calm.
765.120000 767.280000 The power, as we've kind of discovered here,
767.280000 769.920000 might be closer than you think, it's right there.
769.920000 771.680000 Keep diving deep, keep exploring.
771.680000 773.920000 We'll catch you next time on The Deep Dive.
773.920000 777.000000 And that wraps up today's episode of Everyday Explained.
777.000000 780.440000 We love making sense of the world around you five days a week.
780.440000 783.320000 If you enjoyed today's Deep Dive, consider subscribing
783.320000 785.400000 so you don't miss out on our next discovery.
785.400000 787.880000 I'm Chris, and I'll catch you in the next one.